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Post by aubrey on Sept 22, 2016 7:43:01 GMT
They are our problem, which ever way you want to look at it. We have been a part of the actions that have destabilised that whole area; but even if you don't accept that, they are people, just like we are. It could be us.
And they should not be blamed for the actions of our Govt, not having built enough houses, and all the rest of it. A housing shortage is deliberate Govt policy.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 22, 2016 9:05:15 GMT
They are our problem, which ever way you want to look at it. We have been a part of the actions that have destabilised that whole area; but even if you don't accept that, they are people, just like we are. It could be us. And they should not be blamed for the actions of our Govt, not having built enough houses, and all the rest of it. A housing shortage is deliberate Govt policy. That is our difference, you see them as our problem - I don't Your Shangri-La of government spending billions from the famous money tree just ain't gonna happen, Corbyn will never be elected and only a pragmatic leader might win power, like Tony Blair did, and he won't shake the money tree. Remember Denis Healey was going to squeeze the rich until they screamed - he couldn't so he hit the PAYE workers, hard We see the effect of overpopulation already without letting another swarm in, HILD has told us how she has to struggle to cope just like plenty of others have to. Follow your policy and they will struggle even more IMO Charity begins at home, we should properly look after our own
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Post by HILD on Sept 22, 2016 11:48:44 GMT
They are our problem, which ever way you want to look at it. We have been a part of the actions that have destabilised that whole area; but even if you don't accept that, they are people, just like we are. It could be us. And they should not be blamed for the actions of our Govt, not having built enough houses, and all the rest of it. A housing shortage is deliberate Govt policy. That is our difference, you see them as our problem - I don't Your Shangri-La of government spending billions from the famous money tree just ain't gonna happen, Corbyn will never be elected and only a pragmatic leader might win power, like Tony Blair did, and he won't shake the money tree. Remember Denis Healey was going to squeeze the rich until they screamed - he couldn't so he hit the PAYE workers, hard We see the effect of overpopulation already without letting another swarm in, HILD has told us how she has to struggle to cope just like plenty of others have to. Follow your policy and they will struggle even more IMO Charity begins at home, we should properly look after our own
We are the fifth or sixth (depending on stats) richest country in the world and we shouldn't be in a position where successive government policy has created a housing crisis that even a GCSE student doing a simple maths project could predict!
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Post by Deleted on Sept 22, 2016 15:11:42 GMT
That is our difference, you see them as our problem - I don't Your Shangri-La of government spending billions from the famous money tree just ain't gonna happen, Corbyn will never be elected and only a pragmatic leader might win power, like Tony Blair did, and he won't shake the money tree. Remember Denis Healey was going to squeeze the rich until they screamed - he couldn't so he hit the PAYE workers, hard We see the effect of overpopulation already without letting another swarm in, HILD has told us how she has to struggle to cope just like plenty of others have to. Follow your policy and they will struggle even more IMO Charity begins at home, we should properly look after our own
We are the fifth or sixth (depending on stats) richest country in the world and we shouldn't be in a position where successive government policy has created a housing crisis that even a GCSE student doing a simple maths project could predict! All the more reason not to let any more migrants in We have always had a housing problem, I'm guessing it's a hangover particularly because of those destroyed in WW2 I remember Harold Macmillan making great publicity because he was visiting the latest house built, and this was on the days before the swarms of immigrants came here
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Post by lana on Sept 25, 2016 17:22:44 GMT
The Road Ahead by Kirk Douglas who will be 100 this coming December I have always been deeply proud to be an American. In the time I have left, I pray that will never change.
I am in my 100th year. When I was born in 1916 in Amsterdam, New York, Woodrow Wilson was our president.
My parents, who could not speak or write English, were emigrants from Russia. They were part of a wave of more than two million Jews that fled the Czar’s murderous pogroms at the beginning of the 20th Century. They sought a better life for their family in a magical country where, they believed, the streets were literally paved with gold.
What they did not realize until after they arrived was that those beautiful words carved into the Statute of Liberty in New York Harbor: “Give me your tired, your poor, your huddled masses, yearning to breathe free,” did not apply equally to all new Americans. Russians, Poles, Italians, Irish and, particularly Catholics and Jews, felt the stigma of being treated as aliens, as foreigners who would never become “real Americans.”
They say there is nothing new under the sun. Since I was born, our planet has traveled around it one hundred times. With each orbit, I’ve watched our country and our world evolve in ways that would have been unimaginable to my parents – and continue to amaze me with each passing year.
In my lifetime, American women won the right to vote, and one is finally the candidate of a major political party. An Irish-American Catholic became president. Perhaps, most incredibly, an African-American is our president today.
The longer I’ve lived, the less I’ve been surprised by the inevitability of change, and how I’ve rejoiced that so many of the changes I’ve seen have been good.
Yet, I’ve also lived through the horrors of a Great Depression and two World Wars, the second of which was started by a man who promised that he would restore his country it to its former greatness.
I was 16 when that man came to power in 1933. For almost a decade before his rise he was laughed at ― not taken seriously. He was seen as a buffoon who couldn’t possibly deceive an educated, civilized population with his nationalistic, hateful rhetoric.
The “experts” dismissed him as a joke. They were wrong.
A few weeks ago we heard words spoken in Arizona that my wife, Anne, who grew up in Germany, said chilled her to the bone. They could also have been spoken in 1933:
“We also have to be honest about the fact that not everyone who seeks to join our country will be able to successfully assimilate. It is our right as a sovereign nation to choose immigrants that we think are the likeliest to thrive and flourish here…[including] new screening tests for all applicants that include an ideological certification to make sure that those we are admitting to our country share our values…”
These are not the American values that we fought in World War II to protect.
Until now, I believed I had finally seen everything under the sun. But this was the kind of fear-mongering I have never before witnessed from a major U.S. presidential candidate in my lifetime.
I have lived a long, good life. I will not be here to see the consequences if this evil takes root in our country. But your children and mine will be. And their children. And their children’s children.
All of us still yearn to remain free. It is what we stand for as a country. I have always been deeply proud to be an American. In the time I have left, I pray that will never change. In our democracy, the decision to remain free is ours to make.
My 100th birthday is exactly one month and one day after the next presidential election. I’d like to celebrate it by blowing out the candles on my cake, then whistling “Happy Days Are Here Again.”
As my beloved friend Lauren Bacall once said, “You know how to whistle don’t you? You just put your lips together and blow.”
www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/the-road-ahead_us_57e03be4e4b08cb1409749f2
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Post by Deleted on Sept 26, 2016 8:29:29 GMT
"“We also have to be honest about the fact that not everyone who seeks to join our country will be able to successfully assimilate. It is our right as a sovereign nation to choose immigrants that we think are the likeliest to thrive and flourish here…[including] new screening tests for all applicants that include an ideological certification to make sure that those we are admitting to our country share our values…”y"
How many who venture to foreign shores actually "assimilate" In the UK Asian immigrants have settled into particular groups of their own ethnicity, E Europeans tend to congregate together, and so on I choose to visit Spain where I know there are plenty of Brits and that is where I would live
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Post by aubrey on Sept 26, 2016 8:51:45 GMT
"“We also have to be honest about the fact that not everyone who seeks to join our country will be able to successfully assimilate. It is our right as a sovereign nation to choose immigrants that we think are the likeliest to thrive and flourish here…[including] new screening tests for all applicants that include an ideological certification to make sure that those we are admitting to our country share our values…”y" How many who venture to foreign shores actually "assimilate" In the UK Asian immigrants have settled into particular groups of their own ethnicity, E Europeans tend to congregate together, and so on I choose to visit Spain where I know there are plenty of Brits and that is where I would live Yes, but when we do it it's all right
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Post by HILD on Sept 26, 2016 12:24:18 GMT
We are the fifth or sixth (depending on stats) richest country in the world and we shouldn't be in a position where successive government policy has created a housing crisis that even a GCSE student doing a simple maths project could predict! All the more reason not to let any more migrants in We have always had a housing problem, I'm guessing it's a hangover particularly because of those destroyed in WW2 I remember Harold Macmillan making great publicity because he was visiting the latest house built, and this was on the days before the swarms of immigrants came here
No that doesn't work out because we have had migrants coming to this country since the Romans, and boy did they come in droves, then we had 'swarms' of Angles, Jutes and Saxons - so many in fact that they took over, then we had the Danes, ruling us and remaining for centuries. Then the Normans who again came in massive numbers and conquered, then people from Flanders, lots of people from Muslim countries during the European heresy and inquisition debacle, presumably enough black people for Queen Elizabeth the First to remark about it, Huguenots, loads of Germans, Italians, Austrians before WW1, lots of Jews once the laws were changed and they were allowed to move here, which King was that again? Lots of French during the revolution, lots of Scots and Irish during the uprisings , clearances and famines of the hungry 50s, hundreds and thousands of people from the Empire some who came legally and some who were forced to come. Which brings us to the modern era and current immigration which is controlled a hundredfold more than it ever was before. None of this contributed to the housing crisis. Any statistician will tell you that although migrants move in, we the English (and here I include anyone who lives here and is a citizen of the country irrespective of their ancestors country of birth) are decreasing in numbers , so it would follow that there would be more housing available.
It is not the case because the housing crisis was caused by the refusal of the Conservative party to allow councils to build new homes to replace those that were sold by the Right to Buy Act. Councils were also forced to sell these houses at huge discounts. Following that no successive governments have done anything substantial to change this situation. Recent govts. have encouraged private landlords and buy to let schemes/mortgages in order to shirk the social responsibility of providing housing. Now the govt wants to force Housing Associations to sell their houses under this scheme too. I am surprised more people aren't living in caravan parks and shacks like they do in the US.
You mention Macmillan and his famous houses; a scheme which should have been replicated to avoid the situation we are in now. Many who lived in those houses owed their descent to countries other than England - myself I don't have to go back many generations to find my predecessors in Scotland, Ireland and Hungary.
If you are going to say you are not a migrant you need to decide at which point in history you would call the amnesty and declare that everyone before then was 'English' and had the right to live here and that everyone after that was an immigrant, otherwise what you find is that probably 80% of us are immigrants at some point.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 26, 2016 12:25:53 GMT
"John McDonnell vows 'no more Philip Greens'" news.sky.com/More typical naivety from the Corbyn brand of socialists, shows how unfit to govern they are It's like saying there will be no more Trumps. Pathetic
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Post by Deleted on Sept 26, 2016 12:31:10 GMT
All the more reason not to let any more migrants in We have always had a housing problem, I'm guessing it's a hangover particularly because of those destroyed in WW2 I remember Harold Macmillan making great publicity because he was visiting the latest house built, and this was on the days before the swarms of immigrants came here
No that doesn't work out because we have had migrants coming to this country since the Romans, and boy did they come in droves, then we had 'swarms' of Angles, Jutes and Saxons - so many in fact that they took over, then we had the Danes, ruling us and remaining for centuries. Then the Normans who again came in massive numbers and conquered, then people from Flanders, lots of people from Muslim countries during the European heresy and inquisition debacle, presumably enough black people for Queen Elizabeth the First to remark about it, Huguenots, loads of Germans, Italians, Austrians before WW1, lots of Jews once the laws were changed and they were allowed to move here, which King was that again? Lots of French during the revolution, lots of Scots and Irish during the uprisings , clearances and famines of the hungry 50s, hundreds and thousands of people from the Empire some who came legally and some who were forced to come. Which brings us to the modern era and current immigration which is controlled a hundredfold more than it ever was before. None of this contributed to the housing crisis. Any statistician will tell you that although migrants move in, we the English (and here I include anyone who lives here and is a citizen of the country irrespective of their ancestors country of birth) are decreasing in numbers , so it would follow that there would be more housing available.
It is not the case because the housing crisis was caused by the refusal of the Conservative party to allow councils to build new homes to replace those that were sold by the Right to Buy Act. Councils were also forced to sell these houses at huge discounts. Following that no successive governments have done anything substantial to change this situation. Recent govts. have encouraged private landlords and buy to let schemes/mortgages in order to shirk the social responsibility of providing housing. Now the govt wants to force Housing Associations to sell their houses under this scheme too. I am surprised more people aren't living in caravan parks and shacks like they do in the US.
You mention Macmillan and his famous houses; a scheme which should have been replicated to avoid the situation we are in now. Many who lived in those houses owed their descent to countries other than England - myself I don't have to go back many generations to find my predecessors in Scotland, Ireland and Hungary.
If you are going to say you are not a migrant you need to decide at which point in history you would call the amnesty and declare that everyone before then was 'English' and had the right to live here and that everyone after that was an immigrant, otherwise what you find is that probably 80% of us are immigrants at some point.
Interesting analysis, and quite correct It just points out how many are here, and that we are full up We have never had swarms of migrants on this scale, those from the EU are part of the Treaty and are necessary for our economy to be maintained - Polish plumbers for example. We do not need and cannot afford any other economic migrants
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Post by marispiper on Sept 26, 2016 15:32:54 GMT
As this thread is about Trump, it'll be interesting to see how he and Clinton fare, face-to-face. Tonight I believe....
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Post by Deleted on Sept 27, 2016 16:35:30 GMT
As this thread is about Trump, it'll be interesting to see how he and Clinton fare, face-to-face. Tonight I believe.... I am getting old now, but I feel a chill hand clutching my heart at the prospect of the world led by Trump, Putin, maybe Marie Le Pen or her ilk Corbyn and the list could be extended almost ad infinitum. Where are he people of vision courage and integrity that will look after this planet for my grandchildren?
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Post by lana on Sept 27, 2016 17:30:01 GMT
What a thoroughly repulsive man he is.
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Post by marispiper on Sept 27, 2016 17:31:55 GMT
As this thread is about Trump, it'll be interesting to see how he and Clinton fare, face-to-face. Tonight I believe.... I am getting old now, but I feel a chill hand clutching my heart at the prospect of the world led by Trump, Putin, maybe Marie Le Pen or her ilk Corbyn and the list could be extended almost ad infinitum. Where are he people of vision courage and integrity that will look after this planet for my grandchildren? Jon, I wish you hadn't said that...
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Post by Deleted on Sept 27, 2016 17:45:56 GMT
I am getting old now, but I feel a chill hand clutching my heart at the prospect of the world led by Trump, Putin, maybe Marie Le Pen or her ilk Corbyn and the list could be extended almost ad infinitum. Where are he people of vision courage and integrity that will look after this planet for my grandchildren? Jon, I wish you hadn't said that... The same sort of thing or similar has been said many times about others over the years. Reagan to name but one, but somehow we all survived Anyone else noticed how Trump's hair is gradually getting shorter and neater
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