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Post by marispiper on Jun 11, 2024 12:44:20 GMT
Yes Arena should have some insight on this. He always praises the service he gets..Personally, I think Farage has a point - the NHS model is not fit for purpose now and does need a rethink, rather than more money chucked at it.
The fiction of manifestoes has started. You just raise your eyes 🙄 hearing some of the stuff churned out.
One thing I can't quite fathom, is why Starmer appears so hesitant and low key. With his lead in the polls he should be absolutely ebullient...
I hope this is not going to be the tone on 5th July....it makes me wonder if this means he can be pushed around...
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Post by ARENA on Jun 11, 2024 13:16:40 GMT
Yes Arena should have some insight on this. He always praises the service he gets..Personally, I think Farage has a point - the NHS model is not fit for purpose now and does need a rethink, rather than more money chucked at it. The fiction of manifestoes has started. You just raise your eyes 🙄 hearing some of the stuff churned out. One thing I can't quite fathom, is why Starmer appears so hesitant and low key. With his lead in the polls he should be absolutely ebullient... I hope this is not going to be the tone on 5th July....it makes me wonder if this means he can be pushed around... The things I find wrong with the NHS are , not charging non-uk people for treatment , paying out for breast enlargement or reduction and other 'cosmetic surgery' |
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Post by marispiper on Jun 12, 2024 8:03:16 GMT
Yes..people cite these things as 'affecting their mental health' a phrase that opens many doors...including benefits whereby you never need to work again 🙄
Just a few general observations - aside from a very few 'staunch' supporters (of either party) most people I know literally don't know who to vote for. I spose the best outcome is that Labour does not get a huge majority and the Tories step up to being a strong opposition. On which point, Labour has been a pretty weak opposition which does not fill me with confidence regarding them in power.
Neither Labour or Conservatives are up front and both seem to be promising tax cuts (or other monetary sweeteners) when the opposite is true. I was listening to a chap from the Institute of Fiscal Studies who basically said 'they're both lying '
It's also worrying that the rest of Europe seems to have taken a big ouch to the right - that will surely have an impact on us.
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Post by marispiper on Jun 12, 2024 8:18:11 GMT
Do you think Sunak et al have had enough?
You get the impression that governing has become too difficult and they'd be glad of a break.
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Post by ARENA on Jun 12, 2024 8:54:23 GMT
Do you think Sunak et al have had enough? You get the impression that governing has become too difficult and they'd be glad of a break. I did read that he was considering retiring before the election. He knows bloody well he won't be Tory leader after it. |
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Post by hild1066 on Jun 12, 2024 9:29:41 GMT
Yes..people cite these things as 'affecting their mental health' a phrase that opens many doors...including benefits whereby you never need to work again 🙄 Just a few general observations - aside from a very few 'staunch' supporters (of either party) most people I know literally don't know who to vote for. I spose the best outcome is that Labour does not get a huge majority and the Tories step up to being a strong opposition. On which point, Labour has been a pretty weak opposition which does not fill me with confidence regarding them in power. Neither Labour or Conservatives are up front and both seem to be promising tax cuts (or other monetary sweeteners) when the opposite is true. I was listening to a chap from the Institute of Fiscal Studies who basically said 'they're both lying ' It's also worrying that the rest of Europe seems to have taken a big ouch to the right - that will surely have an impact on us. Labour has been in opposition for 14 years. I don't know how you can be that strong in opposition when the majority of the party in power is simply going to override you every time. You can't vote anything down or get much changed in that position. I'd say that the Tories, Reform and others have already taken that lurch to the right and I don't think many traditional Tory voters feel they belong anymore. at least for now. How on earth will scrapping NI contributions for the self-employed do much for the rest of the country. I think we all know that the self-employed are probably the least likely group to pay their taxies and NI correctly anyway. So scrapping it is just another way of saving the money on tax investigations. How many plumbers have given you a proper VAT receipt as opposed to how many offered you a reduction if you paid cash! I think we have to acknowledge that younger people are having a pretty rough time of it. Locked up in Covid, no chance or buying a house or even renting a decent one, probably working until they are 70, shit NHS services and two year waiting lists for mental health issues. That's without us oldies telling them they ar elazy and feckless scroungers. They feel we have completely messed up the country and are intolerant and that a lot of old people who had really good t&cs when they are at work are not supportive of banning zero hours contracts and no sick pay and more interested in whether they'll pay £50 more in tax a year. I'd say they have a point. They also have a point about mental health issues too, we were told to suck it up and put up with it, they don't want to. They don't want 40 years of feeling a bit depressed all the time because nothing looks like its going anywhere and turning into a 70 year old alcoholic because of it. It is mostly us oldies who carp on about things like gender and trans issues, most young people don't care, they just want to let their friends and colleagues be who they are and it doesn't worry them. I'm afraid we are responsible for the way they are and it doesn't depress me at all. I think the young are funny and creative and pushing boundaries as all young people should and perhaps they need a few more breaks than they are getting. If that means 6 appts with a psychologist, then fair enough. Us oldies carry the burdens of our lives like weights on our chests and they don't want to. Brilliant, let them do it and perhaps it will work out better for them. Maybe then we won't get so many scandals about children's homes, and church officials coming out of the darkness of deeply held prejudice, maybe they won't be us. Good for them. |
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Post by marispiper on Jun 12, 2024 10:34:26 GMT
I agree with some of what you say Hildie.. particularly regarding NI contributions - and you're also correct, the only ones putting in (properly) are those on PAYE who have no way of avoiding their dues. The others...so many chancers. Not all mind you - we had some work done last year by a young fella who turned out to be one of my past pupils 😂 We recognised each other immediately! Despite being a chancer in the making at school (which career path he fulfilled!l He now does everything above board - owing to a mate who was caught by HMRC and actually got a custodial sentence. It scared the sh*t out of him. He said it's just not worth it.
I don't agree with some lof what you say about young people. Personally, I think too many see themselves as victims and look for someone to fix this for them - I saw a lot of that at school as well. The trans issue has been blown out of all proportion and that furore has not helped acceptance of gay people either, or their rights. They've been sidelined.
Regarding the other issues - zero hours, impossible housing situation etc. most of that is just down to greed as well as the opportunity to exploit. This is also why immigration does not get addressed - businesses are benefitting.
I don't see anyone saying they will address that. For instance, I don't agree with anyone getting a mortgage to let the property. I'd like to see that stopped as well...
I certainly don't see all this as MY fault!
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Post by marispiper on Jun 14, 2024 8:18:00 GMT
Well, Labour have given us their manifesto.
Being a family rooted in education I was pleased to hear of a boost for teacher numbers. That is,until I understood that it equates to 0.3 teachers per school. Still, the problem with teacher recruitment (pay aside) is nothing to do with gov policy, sadly. Folk just don't want to do it 🫤
For the rest, again, the money doesn't stack up. I know they are hoping for growth but keeping your fingers crossed doesn't guarantee that. Even the Conservatives do that much, do they not? But it hasn't happened ... And taxing private school fees raises a piffling amount. I don't know why they keep on about that.
They will win and I believe it'll be bad - just a different kind of bad.
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Post by rikiiboy on Jun 14, 2024 9:18:23 GMT
Well, Labour have given us their manifesto. Being a family rooted in education I was pleased to hear of a boost for teacher numbers. That is,until I understood that it equates to 0.3 teachers per school. Still, the problem with teacher recruitment (pay aside) is nothing to do with gov policy, sadly. Folk just don't want to do it 🫤 For the rest, again, the money doesn't stack up. I know they are hoping for growth but keeping your fingers crossed doesn't guarantee that. Even the Conservatives do that much, do they not? But it hasn't happened ... And taxing private school fees raises a piffling amount. I don't know why they keep on about that. They will win and I believe it'll be bad - just a different kind of bad. Same **it different depth? |
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Post by hild1066 on Jun 14, 2024 13:35:13 GMT
Well, Labour have given us their manifesto. Being a family rooted in education I was pleased to hear of a boost for teacher numbers. That is,until I understood that it equates to 0.3 teachers per school. Still, the problem with teacher recruitment (pay aside) is nothing to do with gov policy, sadly. Folk just don't want to do it 🫤 For the rest, again, the money doesn't stack up. I know they are hoping for growth but keeping your fingers crossed doesn't guarantee that. Even the Conservatives do that much, do they not? But it hasn't happened ... And taxing private school fees raises a piffling amount. I don't know why they keep on about that. They will win and I believe it'll be bad - just a different kind of bad. It's not just the boost of teachers, that will be targeted in areas of most need. It's having a nursery school attached to every infant school, every child being able to attend a breakfast club and more. As Rayner said, it was great that she got a free lunch at school but sometimes she hadn't eaten anything since the lunch the day before, so a breakfast club is a massive deal. Construction will get a big boost because for the first time in decades councils will be able to build social housing where they need it. They will change planning rules to allow this to happen. Train services will be nationalised as their contracts come up for renewal. Bus routes will be regulated. There will be development funds for areas of deprivation. They will get rid of Hereditary Peers - surely nobody thinks that's something we need to hang on to and also bring in attendance requirements and a retirement age.. They will negotiate a new NHS Dentistry Contract. They will enact the Workforce Development Programme for the NHS - this has been languishing doing nothing since it was agreed. They will restrict overseas workers from taking jobs here that haven't been advertised in the UK first. They will stop employers getting round the tax system by employing overseas workers under the NLW. They will stop probationary programmes for workers where they get no paid leave or paid sickness leave until they have worked for 12 months or more. They will stop zero hours contracts and replace these with permanent part time contracts. They will not take over the water companies because it would cost billions. Instead the will legislate to change the way shareholder bonuses and salary bonuses are determined and ensure these are only linked to refurbishments, repair programmes and new developments. There's a lot more but a most of it is not being covered by the media. I don't think that Labour would keep going on about getting private schools to pay VAT, which is not the same as taxing school fees at all Maris. They would be raising a lot more money if they were doing that. Private Schools are private businesses and any idea that they are charities is really a stretch. Most only offer a very limited number of bursaries and it is often quite opaque who gets them. I am sure the Labour Party don't consider this one of their main policies but the Telegraph is running a massive campaign about it, making sure it is constantly in the media. Stirring up all kinds of frenzied responses from parents. Only 7% of children go to private school and that is their parent's choice, nobody is taking that choice away. However, govts should be concentrating on the 93% of children in state schools and not quasi charities. Research shows that private school fees have gone up way above inflation in the last 10 years and parents have paid that. Schools could decide not to pass on the VAT costs on their purchases as VAT is a specific tax related to what you buy. That's up to them and their business model. If they're not making a profit then they are a bad business. Parents have choices, continue paying the fees, spend the money of private tuition instead, or get on the school board and make sure it runs on a better business model. Looking at who your suppliers are is also a useful enterprise in saving VAT. Suggestions that if private schools close then the state system couldn't cope are also ludicrous. Nobody is suggesting that all 7% of these children will be looking for a state school place in September. Perhaps 0.5-1% might be and they will be spread around the country. It's not as if private schools are all in one city. These figures are manageable. It's a storm in Malory Towers teacup and nothing more. |
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Post by marispiper on Jun 14, 2024 21:13:13 GMT
You obviously are keen on the contents of the manifesto, without any qualms or misgivings...🤔
I note that Blair and Campbell are coaching Starmer - I guess to ensure that the 'loony left' are kept well out of the picture during this campaign. But they're there and they will be loud and vocal once they're in power. That stops me voting for them.
I expect things I profoundly disagree with will be pushed - like abortions up to term permitted.
I mentioned education (my own area of interest)but despite Labour's promised increase (poor imo) it is still below recruitment under the Tories.
Of course, all the aims you list are laudable but I say again, the sums just don't stack up and they reiterate, no tax increases anywhere.
Another thing I massively disagree with is asking doctors to work extra hours when already their working conditions are appalling.
They need that pay increase AND a review of their conditions. They are stretched to breaking now, so no to more hours to address waiting lists.
I've spoken to two people today who said they will probably vote Reform (erstwhile Tory voters) but interestingly one said I'm not telling anyone that though 🙄so there could be some shocks ahead for the Conservatives if people are considering Reform but don't want to say so.
I don't know who to vote for. Trust at an all time low.
Are you a very fast typist Hildie? It'd take me half a day to do a reply that long!
I try and précis my responses.
PS I also think private schools having charitable status is a nonsense and the Lord's definitely needs reform.
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Post by ARENA on Jun 15, 2024 6:02:56 GMT
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Post by marispiper on Jun 15, 2024 11:51:44 GMT
I've just been reading an interview with Sir John Curtis - University of Strathclyde - he of the little steel rim glasses and wild hair... He's so enthusiastic. Apparently he's been obsessed with election data since he was a boy when his parents let him stay up to see some of the results coming in - he just loved the 'swingometer'
Just from his own number crunching perspective, he said that this is a very interesting and difficult election to predict.
While there is huge disenchantment with the Conservatives, there is no great enthusiasm for Labour - unlike 97 when the country was fired up for them... "things can only get better" etc. Those Red Wall seats, what will they vote now? Labour..? or Reform?
He'll be there bashing away on his laptop on the night 😂
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Post by marispiper on Jun 15, 2024 11:54:08 GMT
As an aside, reading about the scale of abuse MPs receive (that's without death threats) via social media, it's a wonder anyone's willing to do it...
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Post by marispiper on Jun 17, 2024 8:35:35 GMT
A little over two weeks off, but no knocks on the door, leaflets or posters in windows. Apathy? Lack of foot soldiers? Not sure..
You'd hardly know there was an election.
I know all the Labour members round here (they are friends/parishioners) but they all gave me their reasons for not standing. Instead some bloke from an area several miles away has been hiked in. Shame, I would've voted for one of them. That's important, to actually know who you're voting for...
I also know quite a few who look like voting Reform - but it's not Nigel they are voting for - could be any nutter!
I was reading in the paper about Europe's move to the right and why that's not been seen here. Actually, it probably is in terms of opinion, but our voting system prevents it and maintains the status quo. Where you have PR, those opinions come to the fore and gain momentum from there.
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